Leonardo da Vinci Myers-Brigs type - MBTI, enneagram and personality type info
" I don't know how you can't see Ti-dom in his nature but rather the novelty-seeking Ne-dom. "He looked at humans like a mechanic would do. " All our knowledge has its origins in our perceptions. Myers had a good understanding of Jung but she oversimplified it. Although, once again, experimentation is just one among many aspects of patterns exploration (Ne). Yet I feel da Vinci is correctly typed as an Ne Dom. Here is CT's take on ENTP vs. ENTPs have Ti afterall. And his art clearly was from a Ti rather than Ne perspective. Just because anatomy wasn't investigated enough there were no INTPs. Ans using your argument when Einstein willfully shared his research he became an ENTP. I fail to point any more INTP who would be like Da Vinci in this regard. it wasn't like he went on his own and said "I want to explore X skin deep". Continuum is more of a Big 5 think because its related to behavior. By doing so you're rebutting against an absolutist strawman stance which bears no resemblance to my stance whatsoever. The introverted types prefer quiet reflection and privacy. Intellect/Introspection is more related to N than I/E according to Jung. " Your take on MBTI is actually the unorthodox one. To find out what your MBTI personality type is you need to complete the MBTI questionnaire and take part in a feedback session from a qualified MBTI practitioner.. Also I don't much care for enneagram aspect of typology. This personality type is highly individualistic and Champions strive toward creating their own methods, looks, actions, habits, and ideas!. Everything about his behavior that I can see leads to the conclusion that he was in fact introverted, and if you look at the functions, his Ti use was clearly more prevalent than Ne. but if you look at what Myers actually said about the topic, she did believe in the dichotomies. I was sheerly arguing in line with Jungian typology, you brought in neo-MBTI stuff which is nothing more than Keirsey's framework. I wonder how would you interpret this, Scotty. He thought of new stuff as he used extensive introverted thinking. And when you think about it, the surface explorations of topics were a lot due simply to his job and what he was commissioned to do. As for differentating between ENTP and INTP polymaths, it's all about whether or not they are an extrovert or introvert to me. His art itself had more basis in perfecting tradition which seems like Ti + Si. I guess he is an ENTP in that aspectAns using your argument when Einstein willfully shared his research he became an ENTP. Why do you think Ne-dom is correct, just to get your line of thought. Its like arguing for something when you are looking at it through a very different angle. An Ne-Ti would invest their time investigating more subjects (interrelated or not) and dissect them with their Ti. All the well known INTPs have literally been the pioneers and masters of their field. INTP are notorious for dropping projects and pursuits half way. As for "multi-field INTP", you seem to think Leibniz is an INTP and he was certainly multi-field. There is nothing higher. I'm not in tune with the Enneagram stuff, but I definitely see him as a 5, with how deeply analytical and knowledge enthusiast he was. By weighing Ti against Ne he's an INTP. And I think you'd even agree to that. If you were to actually use my argument, you would look in context and see that I was talking about a continuum about sharing vs. Whether or not you prefer "Ne" or "Ti" can be just as ambiguous as numbers on an MBTI test. He just took what was given to him and tried to understand it fully. Breaking down things to their principles and parts. Apart from a few sketches what is his contribution tonthe subject. An INTP wouldn't investigate a subject just to leave it like that. Understanding through use of strawmans - what type is that, apparently INTJ. With regards to functions as well I believe that Ti is preferred over Ne. Modern MBTi gurus won't agree though. You're turning my argument into a black and white dichotomy, when I'm really just speaking of shades of gray. Her fault is not choosing one method over other. Here you can explore of famous people and fictional characters.. Well according to Jung himself extroverts would have a broader range of interests than introverts. Ne isn't experiencing, its exploration of ideas from multiple angles and in Ne-doms multi-faceted subjects themselves. com/blog/2013/08/the-difference-between-intp-and-entp/Oddly enough Keirsey who uses behavioral I/E has typed Da Vinci as an ENTP. Please share more about your reasoning on INTP. org/files/46915/46915-h/46915-h. there's no J in MBTI4 letters were originally a short hand for functions. It wouldn't be my first choice though. Not taking either side but would add just a little. Information processing occurs for introverts as they explore ideas and concepts internally. They are well suited to study data thoroughly which most scientific fields require nowadays. The second part is circumstantial at best, wouldn't an ENTP do the same if he is commissioned to do multi subject research, I think he was pretty happy with his predicament. An INTP would loath to leave an unfinished work and are much more thorough. I was just rambling on a tangent about a correlation. Sometimes he could be such a dick: He was a big fan of puns and word games, and Folio 44 of his Codex Arundel contains a long list of playful synonyms for penis. Loyal to their peers and to their internal value systems, but not overly concerned with respecting laws and rules if they get in the way of getting something done. Detached and analytical, they excel at finding solutions to practical problems.. It was reduced to dichotomies just to operationalise the test, not types. The way he left so many projects unfinished seems stereotypically Pe-dom. There's an INTP 7 out there too. :)The attempted operationalization has failed. Well lets look at Goethe (ENFJ), who is mistyped as an INFJ, is another polymath and while his contributions to many subjects are huge, he can never be categorized as a master of one subject. Type 5/INTP tend to put a higher value on knowledge anyway over 7/ENTP, and are more likely to be polymathsthere's nothing about being a polymath that hints at ENTP over INTP, especially when his approach was very technical, detailed, analytical as opposed to experimentalhe's an INTP 5 though. It seems like Leonardo just had a few close friends though. anyway, Ne dom being a lead extroverted function means there are extroverted behaviors associated with it, like a need to share your ideas. E or I I can't really say, but I lean INTP. look at what was said in that article. Its afterall not much explanatory but rather an overall examination of subject. So, ENTP, not INTP. But you mean an ENTP would just experience the subject in a vacuum with attempting to understand it. He's usually typed as a 7. I think it originates more from a misconception that polymath = ENTP, when in reality I think INTP tend to be more of knowledge sponges and definitely more deeply analytical as he was. Also most of his works are incomplete. Look at this way. Da Vinci is more Ne-Ti than Ti-Ne. You seem to be one of the few people here who thinks he is basically an enneagram 5 although you didn't say so, but also ENTP. The idea of him having a bunch of vague concepts in his notebooks is not related to 7 or ENTP. Da Vinci while did research on anatomy wasn't a master in the subject in any sense of word. You use behaviors to gauge I/E which is fine by me, but thats more Keirseyan than Jungian and using your Keirseyan method INTP does make sense. MBTI is basically a 4 factor interpretation of Jung's work, no. By interacting with the physical world, extraverts can process and make sense of new information. Jung theorized that the dominant function acts alone in its preferred world: exterior for extraverts and interior for introverts.. Two very different things. developing ideas. An INFJ might excel at so many subjects at the same because they are much more focused on a singular idea. The dude made detailed drawings that were not surpassed until the 20th century. Compare him to Leibniz, his "breadth" is limited to logic and philosophy. They are well suited to study data thoroughly which most scientific fields require nowadays. "Correction: it was revolutionary. That's an odd assertion. ISTJs make perfect scientists. ISTJs make perfect scientists. But Da Vinci doesn't stay on that subject for long. He didn't go out of his way to seek new stuff. No, that's not my argument. Jung and MBTI originally was related to psyche not behavior. But there's nothing in his history which hints at extroversion or Ne-dom. What is the best option for the MBTI type of Leonardo da Vinci? What about enneagram and other personality types?. Also, whether or not it is their drive to rationalize the world with Ti or experience the world with Ne. Fun fact - although it doesn't prove anything, or so -, Kant had it this way:. You said: "Nah, he went extremely deep in anatomy by the time period's standards whether or not you will ever admit it".
. This goes against the nature of the 7. Did you even read the definition. Lets not waste our energies. Could be INTP in scottology. Read through Personality Types. I think an ENTP more likely to be a polymath than an INTP holds weight. ENTPs are much more fluid in that regard. While Ne does use its environment for data, it is in the end introspective. He just took what was given to him and tried to understand it fully. Well if we use Wiki's ddefinition than most scientists are extroverts since they do shaRe their research with world, they do interact with their peers. That is the breadth of subjects.
. Back to da Vinci though, how is he an extrovert. Introverts in general are more likely to be "intellectual" and intense in their pursuit of knowledge and understanding, but this has nothing to do with breadth. An Ne-dom even in Jungian definition would be looking to the external world for new inspirations. And while perfectionism may not have anything to do with J/P (I'd argue that INTP are in general more perfectionist than INTJ), it certainly has something to do with E vs I. So how did so many INTP scientists share their respective ideas so regularly and with confidence. Compare with François Ier, who was ENFP. His focus was still on understanding (Ti) moreso than experiencing (Ne). And then he makes drawings of mechanical objects, paintings, flying machines etc. htmI'm never going to vote da Vinci as ENTP, so yeah it's a lost fight, especially when you seem to be going on what he actually accomplished and trying to type that against a near impossible INTP template, rather than trying to get inside his head and how he thought. Nah, he went extremely deep in anatomy by the time period's standards whether or not you will ever admit it. MBTI is a dichotomy because its related to cognitive functions; in this case Ti and Ne. Breadth doesnt mean shallow. Introverted thinking is concerned with breaking down a subject to its principles and key parts. If we indeed use different methods of typology then their is no debate whatsoever. The main way his work got out there was because it was commissioned. Anyway, later. So far we have one person saying "cause he's a 7" and another saying "cause he's a polymath", when he's quite clearly a 5 and I don't get the relevance of polymath in E vs I. com/20157-anatomy-drawings-leonardo-da-vinci. They went out and happened to things. Well MBTI is a dichotomy and using absolute behaviors to link to I or E does make it very black and white when its not. Great work guys. External input into his mind seemed to be minimal because he'd rather think about stuff he already knew. How can you justify that its both behavioral and a dichotomy at the same time. So an ENTP who is taking unusual interest in the subjects has to share his research willfully otherwise he becomes an INTP. Ofcourse we can use exceptions to make a case for INTP. Its not so with regards to functions. He was also known to be very private with personal matters and not share a whole lot of of his work. there's nothing 7 about him. You are an I if you score 49 but an E if you score 51. You said: "His focus was still on understanding (Ti) moreso than experiencing (Ne)". You can be an INTP in one test and an INTJ in another. I agree though alot of Jung's work was refined by his NTP students van Der Hoop and von Franz. It took him years to draw the Mona Lisa. da Vinci kept all his stuff to himself in a scribbled notebook and rarely shared anything. He was also pretty social with his colleagues and fellow scientists. Its strange that while she totally believed in using cognitive functions she devised a dichotomy based system which defies both Jung and the more scientific continuum styled Big 5. That is a definite criteria in Ti Dom vs Ne Dom debate. "First I shall do some experiments before I proceed farther, because my intention is to cite experience first and then with reasoning show why such experience is bound to operate in such a way. The way I'm following what you're saying, there may have been no living INTP in the whole world his time period. A Ji-dom would probably get on his own case more. Especially a famous one. I think he's mistyped as extrovert because Da Vinci Code portrayed him as a flamboyant gay. But because he is a genius even when he is a casual researcher his work is a gem. By the CT definition he's an INTP. Anyways looks like another unnecessary impasse. Actually this debate and contrasting Da Vinci with INTPs we have brought in the debate makes my understanding on his type more clear. Or maybe to put it more simply - the extrovert's focus will be to share ideas and the introvert's focus will be to think ideas. You are in the best place to test MBTI and learn what type Leonardo da Vinci likely is!. da Vinci is INTP on all these. Welcome to MBTIBase - PersonalityBase, here you can learn about Leonardo da Vinci MBTI type.. that seems to be a bit of moving the goalposts. And this is the true rule by which those who speculate about the effects of nature must proceed. The test is outdated and non Jungian. We don't have to convince each other. Their utmost focus is to clarify ideas. Behavior isn't the deciding factor in Jungian/MBTI typology. I agree that INTJ is the most single minded of the IN types and INTP seeks broader scope. Thats my position. than reason "Oh, here's one that's even better:. Well they din't know about gravity as well, I guess there were no INTJs as well. I'll get back to this later. MBTI's four dichotomies are on a scale, a scale which oddly divides the dichotomies at midway score. "All our knowledge begins with the senses, proceeds then to the. there's no sign of him taking in a ton of stuff. I assume that they are both Ne dom, LDV being an ENTP. I think INTPs with their tertiary Si are more willing to accept traditional methods of research and more likely to publish their work when they have perfected them. Again, da Vinci was all thinking and no sharing. ENTPs won't run around with half cooked idea. I think you're confusing P vs J with E vs I. Their drive for knowledge is complete understanding of it, INTPs are annoyed by inconsistencies in logic and aren't fulfilled unless an argument reaches its logical conclusion. What good is that. In this site you can find out which of the 16 types this character 'Leonardo da Vinci' belongs to!. Da Vinci has no such primary focus. INTJ are the most intense in pursuing single narrow spectrums of knowledge due to the introvert intensity and judging focus. He jumped from one subject to another, that's not novelty seeking. INTJs are interested in ideas and theories when observing the world.. He never really finished stuff, he was no way a J. You can't miss an INTP. He's an introvert, so he's an INTP. Discover Array, and more, famous people, fictional characters and celebrities here!. " Well if that's your criteria, he's surely an extrovert. Its not like its decided on a scale. Let's look at Wikipedia and what they have to say - "The extraverted types learn best by talking and interacting with others. I agree his Ti is very polished, it is his auxiliary type afterall but he sure is an Ne Dom. And that's because once you take away that INTP template which basically requires godlike analytical drive, it's pretty clear that he had *nearly* godlike analytical drive. Let's face it - we have improved our understanding of various personality topics since Jung first sketched out his ideas. Even if not directly tested, public voting can provide good accuracy regarding Leonardo da Vinci Myers-Briggs and personality type!. Of course scientists in an academic environment have an easy infrastructure for sharing ideas, but that still doesn't mean that their focus can't be more on the development of ideas. understanding, and ends with reason. Selecting Ti over Ne or vice versa is hardly ambiguous. Or whether or not they are aggressive in sharing unfinished ideas or refining and developing their ideas with utmost precision until they are completely satisfied. I agree with the Ne part, but since both NTP types have Ne its true for both. What exactly are your standards for Ti dominance. celebritytypes. but not very descriptive. com "His ideas were mainly theoretical explanations, laid out in exacting detail, but they were rarely experimental. MBTI isn't suited for that. we both have argued our case. In reality, he hid his personal life. da Vinci wasn't a master of anatomy. What extroverted traits did he even have. An INTP would prefer more time on a subject. And to say he never explored something in depth http://www. He carried around that rigorous scientific precision which he prioritized above experimentation, which not only hints at Ti-dominance but also 5. I think this ought to change the mind of ENTP voters. I'd think a 7 would be a more experimental sort of artist. I'd attempt to reply later. "PREFER quiet interaction"Your argument also suggests Ne isn't introspective at all which is an odd assertion. He also lived an extremely private life, doing his best not to challenge social conventions (inferior Fe not Si)How do you differentiate between INTPs and ENTPs in general and respective polymaths specifically. Read something he wrote to get a glimpse into his mind (A Treatise on Painting). Because then one can counter argue that ENTPs can be very focused. He didn't keep to one topic for long. he did not seek novelty, but rather a complete understanding. He thought of new stuff as he used extensive introverted thinking. Descartes is also commonly accepted as INTP. I still think he was a 5 though. " I would expect an ENTP to be more experiment and less theory. Introverts of all kinds are more perfectionist than their extroverted cousins,I don't really understand the E. Anyway, posing that question is somewhat circular logic because da Vinci is the most famous polymath ever and because of htat he's typed as ENTP. All the ENTP arguments don't say anything except well that's what he must be because he knew about more than 1 subject. Is he saying that absolution of knowledge is kinda relative, irrelevant. He was a perfectionist and procrastinator and had a really weird sleeping pattern. I don't agree with all of it but interesting nonetheless. g an ENTP on average would be more intellectually driven than an average ISFP. Nonetheless, I would definitely agree with xNTP. "His interests are way too broad to be an Introvert. He was also pretty social with his colleagues and fellow scientists. You pull the strawman again and again but when its used against you, you complain and get personal. You said: "An Ne-dom even in Jungian definition would be looking to the external world for new inspirations. However since ENTPs do have ample Ti, when they pick up a subject it is looked at through a logical lense. It was deep for that period but not deep enough to be regarded as a revolution in anatomy. Shake hands and go our own ways. htmlLeibniz gave alot of time and focus to perfect Calculus and his philosophy. "It had long since come to my attention that people of accomplishment rarely sat back and let things happen to them. He isn't known to have delved deep into any one subject unlike Leibniz and Descartes mentioned before. We disagree which is fine. I think the key to understanding his personality is to compare him to his peers of the time. Da Vinci studies anatomy, mechanics, aerodynamics, philosophy, painting, and what not. Both those types like to float and exchange ideas, but he kept them mostly confined in his head and paper. The test itself is good for nothin. Ofcourse they'll attempt to understand the wide array of interests they'll have. Every person’s preference can be found on a spectrum, so just choose the letter you identify with most.. A Ti-Ne would invest a lot more time polishing the subject they have selected and not be springy, Both can have similar interests but an ENTP would be more expansive in their interests, an INTP would be more descriptive. You have meddled the two systems together not me. Like from biography. If you want to involve behaviour in the equation use Big 5 as MBTI isn't suited for that. According to Jung himself the ideal scientist is ISTJ. perfectionism have absolutely nnothnin to do with the J/P dichotomyJs are much more likely to be perfectionists than Ps so that doesn't really support your case. The standards for being INTP is very easy. I agree with ENTP more than INTP for him. The fact that no one bothered to delve into the subject for along time is irrelevant here. Einstein obviously was much more concerned with the development than the sharing, so using my argument, Einstein wouldn't be an INTP. Because he is a genius his works are incredible but no one will ever call him a master of anatomy. I guess he is an ENTP in that aspectIt's not the action of sharing ideas that makes you an introvert or extrovert, but the *focus* on sharing ideas. They seem very similar and have a strong kinship. His interests are way to broad to be an Introvert. You said: "He didn't go out of his way to seek new stuff. From what I read I'm just getting introvert vibes, specifically INTP. While INTPs are relatively more broad in their interest base, da Vinci is a stretch. Although it's quite rare (not to say he's an INTP btw). If you enjoyed this entry, find out about the personality types of Visual Arts characters list.. Anyhow we can get back to it later.